Episode Summary
In January, Esi was interviewed by the presenters of 105.5 Swindon fm. They chatted about disabled people in workplace and Esi offered advice and tips on how to offer support for disabled employees
Transcript
Gary:
Hi, welcome to Mind your own business on Swindon 105.5 My name is Gary Riley from the Federation of small businesses, and we have Amelia tech helping, hi Amelia.
Amelia:
Hi Jerry. Welcome back.
Gary:
Thank you. And you have the able help of Nick Stevenson on the desk so nothing can go wrong
Nick:
With help. I don’t know about able help, nothing would go wrong at all.
Gary:
And I’m pleased to say we have Esi Hardy with us. Hi, Esi,
Esi:
Hi
Gary:
And you’re going to give us a story of setting up in business yourself. Yeah, past year.
Esi:
Absolutely. Yeah.
Gary:
And you give us some background and how you actually got there, yeah, what gives you that budding ambition? Yeah? Well, yeah, let’s see, yeah, who wants to start a business when you know all the problems that kind of cut well,
Esi:
I think if I knew the problems, I would never have gone into business for myself. Say it’s probably a good thing that I didn’t know.
Gary:
A few people have mirrored that over the years. Yeah, but let’s start with the first piece of music.
Amelia:
Which is holy mountain, Noel Gallagher’s high flying birds.
Music plays
Amelia:
And welcome back to mind your own business, and today, our guest is Esi Hardy, from celebrating disability. Welcome Esi,
Esi:
Thank you.
Amelia:
Really pleased to have you here.
Esi:
I’m really excited to be here.
Amelia:
Well, we’re going to talk we’re going to talk today about what you do and what your business does to help employers support and employ disabled people. And first of all, as Jerry mentioned earlier, we want to know how you arrived at doing, what you would, what you what you’re doing.
Esi:
Well, I was born on a Tuesday. No, I’m joking. So I am 36 years old. I don’t tell many people that. So because I only look 20, so I started my career, actually as an actress. So from the age of 14, I wanted to be famous, and I wanted to be in the movies and live next door to Robbie Williams. It didn’t happen, unfortunately. So I quit, and I decided, when I say I quit, I didn’t actually quit altogether. I went into running drum workshops, and I fell into kind of supporting disabled young people, people with learning disabilities and adults with learning disabilities to develop the confidence and put on their own shows to prove that they could do their own theatre, so they would devise their own plays. And I really enjoyed helping people to develop their confidence through theatre and through something they really enjoyed doing. And what I was hearing from them all the time is that they were frustrated by the fact that they weren’t given more opportunities. You know, these were young people who were at college, so 1819, year olds were having the same opportunities as other young people their age, and I wanted to do more about it, because as a disabled person myself, I related to what they were talking about, and I could empathise on a level that I understood where they’d been because I was at the same place, so I kind of moved slash fell into training as well. So I worked for Hampshire County Council, where I delivered training to social workers, and I sat on panels and talked about how we can invite disabled people that would use services of social services. So people call them service users, but I hate the term. So helping people that use services to develop their own confidence.
Ameila:
So you’ve, you’ve been part of training disabled people and working this with disabled people, or your work in life?
Esi:
Well, yeah, kind of So, yeah, I started training and working with disabled people to develop confidence, and I moved on to training people that work with disabled people to build confidence around supporting disabled people help them understand the barriers that disabled people face. And then I worked for a charity just outside Andover called the Enam trust, and I worked to support the organisation to understand how to develop an organisation that can better support disabled people to do what they want to do. So that was both employing disabled people and also engaging with disabled customers, and doing it in a way that disabled people could access the services and the things that they were providing them to do so, either from reading stuff on their website to engaging in consultations to just doing what they wanted to do and going out with their friends and families
Amelia:
to truly, truly inspirational. Then, well,
Esi:
yeah, I mean, I don’t like, I say yes, but I don’t, I don’t really like the term inspirational, because it’s not, it’s not that I did it because I wanted to inspire people. Is that I didn’t wanted something I believed in. And yeah, so I think to call myself inspirational would just be really big headed, but it was something that I really enjoyed doing, and something that I could I felt that people were getting from so I carried on doing it, and then about a year ago, I decided that I wanted to do something a bit different. So rather than developing the confidence of disabled people, I wanted to develop the confidence of business owners and people around businesses to be able to support disabled people to achieve and be productive in workplaces.
Amelia:
So all your work in life, then you’ve pulled all your experience and knowledge together and pulled it all into celebrating disability your business.
Esi:
Well, yeah, no, it’s true. So yeah, that’s a really nice way of looking at it. Yeah, yeah. I kind of the way I do things as I don’t like to plan too far ahead. I like to leap. There’s some people like to plan, you know, years and years in advance. I like to leap. So I when I said, I think, I said to my boss, I think it’s time that I did something else. He said, What do you want to do? And I was like, I don’t know. And then a month later, I was like, Oh, I know what I’m going to do now. I’m going to set up a business, and so that’s what I did, and it really worked well for me, because I suppose you’re right, because of all the experience I had, personal experience of living with disability and professional experience of working with disabled people and training people to support disabled people, they kind of put me in the right stead for
Amelia:
And from your own experience as a disabled person, did you find that employers didn’t always know how to deal with absolutely, yeah, no disability and helping you into the workplace and everything around that?
Esi:
Yeah. So I mean, I mean, we’ve got back quite a few steps. So as I said, I was an actress, and I think, you know, I’m not saying all the reason I didn’t get famous is because nobody would take me on. It’s probably because I wasn’t very good as well. But, you know, I think that people, you know, it was the early, well, mid 90s, I should say early, 2000s and, you know, people weren’t disability confident, so they weren’t aware of the things that disabled people could do or the support that was out there to support disabled people. So rather than taking a chance on something that might be slightly more difficult, people tended to go with what they knew and what was easier.
Amelia:
Yeah, which is, which is always easier, yeah.
Esi:
And, you know, it kind of still happens today. It echoes all the way through what I do. I do. You know, every time I go somewhere, I have to prove that, you know, I’m good enough to be there and that I’m an intelligent business person, because people just see the wheelchair before they see me. And sometimes they think, Oh, bless how sweet she’s out and about, or let’s talk to the person that’s with her. And it’s not until I open my mouth and start talking that they think, oh, you know, this person actually has something to say. We’ll stop and listen.
Amelia:
You know, I think it’s, I think it’s really sad that it’s like that. And I know Esi, when you and I have had a conversation in the past, it’s not about understanding somebody’s disability, it’s understanding their ability.
Gary:
And it doesn’t matter what the disability is, it’s how you react to yourself.
Esi:
Exactly. Yeah. I mean, you know, I talk a lot in celebrating disability about what business owners can do, but also it’s about what disabled people can do themselves as well. So everybody has to work together. So as a disabled person, I have to have the confidence to say that this is what I’m capable of. Give me a chance, and I have to like everybody else, I have to train myself to actually know what I’m talking about so I can be taken seriously. And I have to prepare myself so it does work both ways.
Gary:
We talked off here Esi about how so many employers are nervous about taking on somebody who’s disabled, they want to help, but as you mentioned a few minutes ago, they’ll go with the familiar. What a potential employer looking to take on you or someone else with a disability like yours or difference? How should they approach that person?
Esi:
Oh, how long do we have?
Amelia:
I was just going to say at this point, should we listen to our next track? We hold, hold that thought and then come back into that answer in that question, because it’s all about your your business and how you work with employers. Isn’t, yeah, absolutely okay, and our next track is, there’s a kind of hush by the carpenters.
Music plays
Gary:
We’re speaking to Esi Hardy about her business celebrating disability. Now I asked you the most difficult question, Esi, just before the news, you probably need a couple of hours to reply, but tell us in sort of 10 minutes, how do employers approach disabled people, and how would you suggest to approach disabled people?
Esi:
Okay, so, I mean, I think people ask me that all the time, actually. So I was at a talk the other day, and somebody said, How do I talk to a disabled person? And I said, Well, you can start by saying hello, and then take it from there. And funny when you say it, but lots of people don’t, don’t realise that it’s that simple. There’s so much stigma and taboo around disability that people think, oh, I need to say it in the right way, or else, you know, I’ll get sued, or they’ll never talk to me again. But actually, as disabled people, we are just people, so talking to us about like a normal person, if you need to know how you can support us, you know, just ask us that as well. So I think the things that employers are scared about when they’re hiring disabled people is your cost implications, financial cost implications of equipment that needs to be put in place. But actually only 4% of reasonable adjustments that support a disabled person in workplace have a cost implication and the advocacy that
Gary:
Say that again, I mean, that’s important. Only 4% of the changes actually cost anything.
Esi:
Yeah, exactly. So, I mean, that could be like equipment, so a table or a chair, but a lot of adjustments are about having a parking bay in a certain place, or being able to have flexible working hours, maybe to avoid rush hour traffic, or, you know, moving the office chair to a different position so the person could be more comfortable, or having a few more regular breaks during the day. So it doesn’t mean that the person won’t be as productive, or that they can’t work as hard. It just means that they do it a slightly different way. And actually a disabled person who is happy and feels valued in their role is more likely to stay with the company for a long time because of the extra barriers that present people moving around and finding other employments, barriers to attitudes, and also because if you found what you’re looking for, then, then you might not ever have to move if you feel like you’re being valued. So if you, if you support your disabled person in the right way, you you might have a life there.
Amelia:
I mean, that’s that’s a very important point, isn’t it, and especially at the moment where we’re in a situation of high employment, you know, it’s all about retaining your existing staff. You know, treating them better, if that’s possible, you know, and in order to retain them, yeah,
Esi:
yeah, absolutely. And there’s no you know, the say, the rules that apply to retaining employees to stay do not differ for disabled people. So we retain people by listening to them, by understanding their needs and supporting them, and by praising people and a few other things. And it’s all about mutual respect. Isn’t all about mutual respect, opening up these lines of communication. There’s no different for a disabled person. I blog a lot for celebrating one of my blogs is about harnessing experience. So you I walk into an office space and people are, oh my gosh, we don’t know what she needs. Well, actually, if you ask me, I’ll probably be able to tell you in 30 seconds. It’s as simple as that. It’s as simple as that. And actually, I come armed with all of the information I need to support me, and quite a few of the things, you know, I come with my wheelchair so I don’t need the chair moving. I don’t need to worry about me standing up for long periods of time because I already have my chair I’m sitting down, therefore I can sit. I can lean my chair back. So I can fall asleep in your meeting or stay awake. You know, I’ll tell you exactly what I need, and most disabled people do the same if they feel that they’re confident to if they’re not going to be devalued for doing so.
Amelia:
So is this the primary focus of your business?
Esi:
Kind Yes. So it’s all about raising awareness and helping break down those barriers of attitude that people are so worried about. So I do that through running workshops. So I go into a business and run workshops for up to about 20 delegates at a time on general subjects about disability or more specific ones, if I do and I also do consultancy work, so I might go into a specific organisation and work with them on a specific need. So if they want to be more inclusive in their recruitment process, I can help them put things in place in order for that to happen, I can help them with things like their policies and procedures on, you know, employing disabled people in their reasonable adjustments, or engaging disabled customers and all those things.
Amelia:
I mean, that sounds as though it would be very helpful to a lot of employers. I know you’re not based locally in Swindon, and we met a few months ago, didn’t we in there? That’s why you’re here today, telling everybody about what you do if, if we’ve got listeners that want your help, I presume you’re happy to work in Swindon with employers as you are,
Esi:
Absolutely no. I definitely am. Half car will travel. So I’m based in Basingstoke by working about an 80 to 100 mile radius, fair radius as well.
Amelia:
Yeah. So any Swindon employers who would like Esi help, it’s perfect, isn’t it?
Gary:
And from what you’re saying, Esi, I get the impression that it doesn’t matter whether somebody’s employing an able bodied person or not, the employer should be looking out for everybody’s abilities,
Esi:
Absolutely, so I promote inclusive workspaces and inclusive environments. So for me, I train disability quality rather than awareness, because for me, awareness is passive, whereas equality is active. So the when, as you learn it, you think, Oh, that’s nice. I’ll go back to my job now, whereas equality, you think, Oh, well, that’s really interesting. What can I do to make that a reality, so I do that, but also I talk about inclusion rather than accessibility. So what’s accessible for a disabled person is also accessible for a non disabled person and all of their peers around them. So if we take it out of the office for a minute and take it into a venue, for example, if a disabled person can get into a venue and buy drinks at the bar, then they’re going to bring all their friends and family, and those friends and family are not necessarily disabled, whereas, if that disabled person can’t get in, then all of them, their friends and family and everybody will always go somewhere else, because they want to include the person who is disabled. So making it accessible and making it inclusive for all makes perfect business sense.
Gary:
The BBC did a short series about this term last year, talking about shopping experiences or going to a bar or restaurant, and it was quite shocking to hear the situation. I don’t go a lot of clothes shopping, but apparently it was really difficult going into a lot of stores, and I think lots of stores nowadays are just trying to make the best use of the space. So it’s cramps, and there’s nothing worse. I certainly see it in supermarkets, where special offers are lined up along the normal alleyway. So even I would have trouble getting past some of them that must make it really difficult. If you decide you’re going to a store that you’ve not been to before, you don’t know what you’re going to face, do you
Esi:
Absolutely I mean, it’s really frustrating. I’m really confident. I’m very outgoing. So I’m one of those people that will challenge. I’m not happy with something I will say, But not everybody’s like that. Not everybody should. So it stops disabled people from going to those places, because they are worried rightly so about what they’re going to face. So a lot of disabled shoppers go online, or they stay to the same boutique store that they know is accessible, and they know that the customer service is good. I think the highest percent, it’s a really high percentage of project. I can’t remember the actual statistic, but very high percentage of disabled. What turns disabled people away from from shopping in a particular place is bad customer service ability, but the highest one is a lack of awareness and a lack of empathy. And the amount of people, I’m not saying everybody, because a lot of people are really good, but a lot of people in shops just want to get your money and go but what they miss out on is the fact, in order to get that money, you have to treat your customer well. And it doesn’t matter if they’re in a wheelchair or if they can’t see or if they’ve got a buggy, you know, come in as a customer.
Amelia:
That applies to any business absolutely, because, yeah, and I think with retail, I mean, it’s more important than ever now, especially as the majority of people are increasing their online shopping habits. Yeah, I know that town centres and, you know, shopping centres are starting to struggle, and particular retailers are struggling where there’s a big move to online shopping,
Esi:
Absolutely.But you know, the funny thing is, a really high percentage of online shops are not accessible. So when you talk about websites, you know, unless a website has got specific things in it, it’s still not accessible for a disabled shopper. So for example, if somebody with a who’s blind goes on a shop and they can’t see things. They need to use their computer to read to them. And if that website’s not set up for that, then they still can’t shop there, and they will go somewhere else. So making your website accessible and inclusive is as important as your physical space.
Amelia:
Well, absolutely. I mean, it’s like not being able to get through the door if the shop, if you’re in a wheelchair, absolutely. Yeah, that’s the same. I mean, that’s a really important point on that point. Should we have our next track? Jerry’s got the headline straight after that, haven’t you? And then we come back and we’ll carry on this really interesting discussion.
Esi:
Thank you.
Amelia:
So our next track is tell me When by the human leave.
Music Plays
Gary:
with business news this week, some of you will remember, if you were listening in two weeks ago, we had Julian Ross from the enterprise network, which is run by Wiltshire Business Council. That’s not quite right, is it? Wiltshire Council’s business services. That’s the correct title. And Julian has got one of his regular events, and it’s for women in business networking on Thursday the 25th so that’s this Thursday coming up 1030 to 20 and that’s manor house, Enterprise Centre and royal wooden Bassett. Then next you’ll remember what it was called before that was BBC Wiltshire. Sorry, you’ve lost me now It’s lime kiln studio that was just come back to me. Most people will know that as lime kiln studio, how? Yeah, I know where it is, but it’s never had anything to do with me, but it’s just a minor house Enterprise Centre will mean nothing to most locals, but if you drive into royal wooden bus, it’s one of the first turnings on the right, huge old building, and it was BBC or low income studio. So that’s it, 10:30am to 12. But it ends with a buffet, which is always nice. I’ve been to a couple of Julian’s events, and it always stresses that the boot fee is one of the most important things. That’s when you get together to top business, it’s free, but you have to book before hands. So if you’re going to the enterprise network.co.uk, book in there, if you forget that, because remember the enterprise network or 10, it’s even easier to remember 10. So that’s Jordy and Rose running these regular events the enterprise network through Wiltshire Council, and today we saw on the BBC website a survey showing how people’s spending habits have changed from 1957 to 2017 now, back in 1957 less than 10% of people’s spending was on housing. Now it’s nearly 20% need to say because it’s much more expensive to buy a house or even just rents. It’s probably no surprise to hear that then people spend over 35% of their money on food, the absolute basics. Now it’s just over 15% and yet, we spend a lot more going out to eat, but as a percentage of income, it’s a lot lower. Smoking costs have gone from more than 10% to almost no. Clothing has gone from 10% down to 5% so once again, we spend a lot more time shopping and well women at least, spend a lot more on clothes. And yet still, the percentage of the income has gone from 10% to 5% and close and finally, on services and leisure, that’s gone from 10% of people’s income to nearly 25% and I don’t think that’s any surprise, people spend more time going out, enjoying themselves, whether it’s to bars, gyms, God knows what’s shopping. So complete difference. People have got a lot more choice with the spending habits nowadays, except probably when it comes to housing, because we know there’s such a difference, we don’t have much choice with housing and money mail today has has done a short summary on can you outsmart the scammers? And they say that only 9% of US answered eight financial fraud questions correctly. Some examples of these eight questions were you get an email that seems to be from your bank and it says there is an error on your account. Please transfer your funds to this account until we sort it out, then we will transfer back. Quite a number of people have fallen for that, and of course, the money is going to fraud accounts or an email, again, supposedly from your bank says there’s unusual activity on your debit card call this number. We will show you how to sort this so it will give you a new account number to make sure it works correctly. And needless to say, it’s the same result once again. Or they ask you to go to their websites or phone a number that they give you, quite simply, banks, building societies, financial institutions will not give you a number or email address out of the blue, they will always tell you go to the regular website or the place that you would normally contact them. Out of the eight questions, I’m pleased to say that I get seven out of eight right. So as somebody in financial services for the past 30 odd years, hopefully I should. And the one that caught me out was where they actually said, go to our site and we’ll give you an account number to check out. That was where I get caught out. So you’ve got to be on your guard all the time when you supposedly get an email from them. I actually got a friend’s daughter who emailed me this morning to say I’ve had this from HMRC, the student tax and after going to this website to claim my tax back, and at first I struggled. I thought, well, that’s fine, but she’s always been employed part time, so she’s never paid much, if any tax at all. Then I saw the email address instead of.uk it was.co jp, which is, in fact, the name before I looked Japanese, but it took me about three attempts to read that before I realised it was a fraud. So it’s not easy to spot all these scams. So as ever, it’s just a case of be aware if in doubt, go on to the main bank sites or whatever, don’t go on to one that they’ve told you about.
Amelia:
So some really important advice that piece, Isn’t it scary? Well, it’s happening more frequently as well. That’s it. Yeah. So back to mind your own business and our guest, Esi Hardy from celebrating disability, we’ve heard how you start to help employees. What’s What does your support and guidance look like from a practical perspective? We understand about advice. I mean, do you have templates? Do you have documents? Do you have training guides?
Esi:
So yes, yes, and also No, no, because everything is, you know, everything has to be individual. And I know that it’s kind of everybody says, oh, you know, it’s so bespoke, but it has to be bespoke, because no two businesses are like and no two employees are alike. So where I do deliver specific packages. So for example, workshop packages, I go into a business and work with them to deliver a workshop for the delegates that was made up of what they need and what their outcomes want to be and what they look like. Oh, that’s fantastic. So I would sit down for a while with a person that originally to find out you know why they called me in the first place. Because sometimes why people call it’s not really the what they want to get to at the end. We just want some more disability awareness training. Well, actually, it’s because when we interviewed the last three disabled people, they decided they didn’t want a job with us, and we want to figure out why we think that’s quite a high turnover, for example. So it might be about, you know, the policies that the business has in place to be inclusive, so we might around inclusion of disabled people and non disabled people. So I try to tailor all the workshops to individual needs. Typically.
Amelia:
How long is a workshop session? Or does that very dependent on need as well?
Esi:
I’d say around half a day. I mean, it’s quite a lot of information. My workshops are workshops, and they’re not training. They’re not sessions where I just deliver and you should I say, you have to do this because I say so, people are encouraged to debate, um, with the ideas that I have, because a lot of the things are facts, but a lot of them is, you know, personal belief or experience. So it’s important that we hear from other people about what they think and why they think it. Is there
Amelia:
Is there a pattern to the type of person that you typically chain train is a HR person? Is it a manager or business owner?
Esi:
So I’d say typically that the the people that contact me in the first place or HR, they might be managers if it’s a smaller business, and HR for slightly bigger business, but there’s no typical company that I work with. So over the last year that I’ve been running, I’ve worked with pest control, and I’ve worked with care agencies and careful a couple of local authorities. I’ve worked in activity centres, and I’ve also come to work for the DWP. So it really varies. There’s a wide range of target audiences, because people are everywhere. We don’t hide away. We’re everywhere, so everyone needs us. So yeah,
Amelia:
right, sounds fantastic. And do you, do you write up policies? Do you help them with writing up policies? So,
Esi:
Yeah, I wouldn’t say, here’s a policy I made earlier. I would say, right, let’s have a look at what your what your organisation or your company goals are, and let’s write a policy around jointly, jointly, yeah, but let’s not break the law at the same time. So I’m not gonna say we can’t hire disabled people. I’m not gonna let you have that in your policy, but you will work the policy out to what you what you would like it to be that is still inclusive of disabled people.
Amelia:
Right, sounds fantastic. I think we’re we’re coming towards the end of the hour, and I know that you’ve mentioned about your future plans for the business. Would you like to share anything that you have in mind of where your business is going in the next one, three or five years, apart
Esi:
Apart from having my own island? Well, okay, so I would like to mean, obviously, in the first year, it’s kind of about learning what I want. So this year is more about kind of developing those relationships, kind of setting up things that can be ongoing processes for people. So supporting them, not just on a one off or, you know, a six month basis, but supporting them on a long term basis. I really want to find some associates for celebrating disability. So I’m disabled myself. I’m physically disabled. I want to find other people who have impairments, not necessarily physical impairments, that can share their experiences of being disabled and also sharing their experiences of working in the workplace to give us a wider reach to people. I’m also looking for disabled people who want to share their views on my podcast about their disability, managing that in the workplace. So if you’re either of them, please get in touch. Also, if you’re a business and wanting some support, please also get in touch. I hate giving my I hate doing this part, but my contact details, if anyone is interested. My website is www.celebratingdisability.co.uk, and my phone number is 01256578016. I’d be happy to offer a 30 minute free consultation that’s either face to face or over a video conferencing and take it from there. On my website, you’re able to download the type of packages I provide and my type of prices as well,
Amelia:
And ultimately, from a franchising perspective, you’re talking about over the next four to five years, you’d like to consider setting up four centres, four or five centres, with a view to maybe later on, franchising.
Esi:
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that’s where the associates come in. So I’d like four to five associates around the country. They all have to be disabled some kind of impairment doesn’t have. It doesn’t have to, you know, it doesn’t have to be the same impairment as mine. But everybody has to have lived experience and professional experience of disability and working with working in the workplace with a disability, to be able to outsource and stretch out across the country, so the places that I can’t get to, or the areas that I’m not isn’t in my experience, that I can say, oh, there’s a person that can help you with that. They’re really experienced. So that’s what I’m looking for.
Amelia:
Okay? And I guess from other business aspects, you’re happy to talk to all sorts of business owners in partnerships and making good connections. Absolutely.
Esi:
I think it’s all about connections and partnerships. I don’t see anybody as a competitor. I see them as a potential partner,
Amelia:
absolutely. And that, I mean, that’s the that’s the right way to look at it.
Esi:
Yeah, I think it’s the only way where you can support each other.
Amelia:
Exactly
Esi:
I quite often go along to training sessions on the same subject as mine, to be able to learn good practice from someone else.
Gary:
I think it’s good Esi just to look at working habits as a whole, because it’s not just disabled people that should be considered as everybody and maybe, you know, as you mentioned earlier, having more flexible work breaks whatever isn’t, a bad thing
Esi:
yeah. So I have a, I work with a partner at the moment, Ryan, and he says all the time, and rightly so, that inclusion is great for disabled people, but also means that all your other employees have a better time as well. So for example, if you instal in this is, this is a big example, but if you installed a lift so a person in wheelchair can get upstairs, it also means that if you’ve been running up and down all day, for a non disabled person, it’s slightly easier for you to get upstairs. If your office and open environment, it means that people will naturally communicate more with each other, so an inclusive workspace for disabled people, also it supports everybody, will benefit the employer again, tremendously.
Gary:
So you’ve talked a lot about work, and obviously that’s what the interview is about. We’ve touched on shopping. How about leisure generally? I mean, lots of disabled people must want to get involved in sports, going to the cinema, whatever. But I can imagine all these entertainments could cause an issue. How do you get up the stairs?
Esi:
You’ve given me two minutes. Massive subject. So, yeah, I mean, you were mentioning interestingly before in your business news about leisure, about how people are spending more money on leisure. And it’s so true. So the amount of times I hear, Oh, you know, we don’t need accessible gym equipment because disabled people don’t come here. And I think, well, let’s just rewind slightly and say that again and listen to what you’re saying. Oh, you know, we don’t need more accessible rooms in our hotel because we don’t have disabled guests. Well, it’s probably something to do with the five steps leading up to the front door. So yeah, making your venues inclusive and making your leisure disabled people don’t sit around. They don’t go to bed at eight o’clock in the evening. We do go to the cinema. We do want to go with our friends. So we don’t just want to go with one person who sits next to us. We might want to go with a group of people, and then we might want to go out for dinner afterwards. Oh, and then, actually, we might want to go clubbing, believe it or not, not anymore, but I did all the time to go clubbing. So making all of those inclusive and accessible so a disabled person can live the same life as everybody else. And if you know people say, Oh, but we don’t see disabled people out. But the more you make things inclusive, the more disabled people you will see out. And always remember that physical disabilities only make up 2% of disabilities, so the remaining 98% is made up of people with invisible and hidden disabilities. So you might see a disabled person and never know about it, but they still need help.
Gary:
Yeah, I think it’s just shocking this day and age. I mean, my example, I love football. Put a football match. Disabled people are down the bottom front. Yeah, they’ve got a little shelter. That’s it. They’re away from it. You can’t see the game properly. Down the front, and so say it’s dangerous if you’ve got the ball hitting. Very few clubs actually have a lift. And some of them say, No, we need the football trust to help us out. I mean, what does it cost football clubs in this day and age to put a lift in and that’s just what the example I know of. There must be lots of examples.
Esi:
There are so many examples. I mean, I don’t know how much time I got there, but I’m a massive Robbie Williams fan, like major, major, and the amount of venues that I’ve had to kick up a fast because I can only go with one of my friends, and I understand that the bays have to be limited, but at the same time, I want to enjoy it, and I want to enjoy the atmosphere with everybody else. And there are so many more examples. I think the football one is a great example. And if we go back to what I was saying about valuing people, if you show people that they’re welcome, they’re going to come again and again and spend money with you.
Amelia:
Well, I think, as you mentioned, I mean, this is a huge topic and subject all on its own, and we’re sadly come into a close for today’s show. Esi, would you mind to remind people? Would you like to remind people how they can contact you? Of
Esi:
course. Yeah. So my website is celebratingdisability.co.uk, and my number is 01256578016, the website’s the easiest way to contact me. All my contact details are on there, and you send me an email or listen to some of my listen to my blogs with other people on them. It’ll be great. And I’d love to connect with you and just have an informal chat.
Gary:
Esi, thank you for coming in. We’d love to see you again, maybe towards the end of this year, to see how things are developing. So this won’t be the last interview. Many thanks for coming in. Thank you. Thank you everyone for listening in, and thank you Amelia and Nick for all your tech hopping.
Amelia:
It’s a pleasure.
Music Plays